So far, Ken Robinson has urged us to follow our passions and discover our elements. He believes that when you love what you do, especially when it is for a living, you are completely in your element. He urges everyone to do this.
However, not everyone buys this advice. Read the following links to two articles that disagree with this type of thinking. By the way, Robinson isn't the only one to offer this advice either: Steve Jobs did the same thing in his graduation speech at Stanford several years ago.
After reading the two articles, leave a post stating what you agree or disagree with in each article. Use direct quotes and fully support why you either agree or disagree.
Finally, respond to two other posts left by your classmates.
Thanks.
Here are the links:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/frederickallen/2011/10/12/steve-jobs-bad-career-advice/
and
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/10/follow-your-bliss-sort-of/246350/
If you're interested, here is the Steve Jobs speech that the articles refer to.
I agree with Steve Job's speech. When he says, "Don't settle" he is right. Settling for convenience or money will never make you happy. Robin Hanson said that if everyone followed his advice no one would be willing to do the dirty jobs, but not everyone has opportunities to find their element, therefore some people are always going to settle.
ReplyDeleteI agree. And here too is where finding an element to use as a hobby can make working a less desirable job more appealing. And who's to say your generation - or any generation from now on - will only have ONE job or career path. So we all may be stuck working a second job that is not tied to our element. But having a hobby that makes life richer will pay off in the end.
DeleteIn the first article the mention of Robinson's blog as being "biased" seems a highly defensive if not inappropriate statement to make. In my opinion you do not want to go right out and say that this person is overly biased, thats just bad journalism, you need to give reasons, and all the reader to figure it out, but it needs be quick and decisive, saying something is biased from the get go is going to get you nowhere. I find that Robinson's statements especially those regarding taking chances are risky, but this is america, and no one gets anywhere without taking risks.
ReplyDeleteSteve Jobs story is inspirational, and truly incredible, but it important yes to understand he got lucky. Jobs was a creative person, an egocentric, anal retentive, with ADHD! But what resounds with me is following my passion. If I worked on my math homework I wouldn't have over a hundred photos publicly visible, or nearly two hundred posts on my blog in a little over a year. I wouldn't create the graphic art, and visually appealing themes, and mashups. Robinson has many good points. I like the idea that standardized testing does nothing but give us a number that ultimately limits us. I would rather have no scores and just follow my passion, let it represent my talent, not a botched math test score I managed to get through in twenty minutes.
Luck is a great point. And one Robinson discusses in his book. No doubt in every success story there is a great deal of luck. I think of Stephen King. He actually threw the manuscript for his first novel, Carrie, in the garbage. His wife noticed it when taking out the trash and dug it out and convinced Stephen to keep trying.
DeleteBut I think there's some truth in the idea that we can make our own luck through our passion and attitude.
Tobias, you've found your passion. You're fortunate. Follow it and stay the course!
I disagree with what Robin Hanson says in the second article. Even though Steve Jobs announced in his speech to find a job that you love doesn't mean that everyone has to earn a degree or obtain a glamour job. If someone enjoys being a garbage man for example, that is their calling and they found their Element.
ReplyDeleteGood point, Chris. And there is nothing wrong, either, with having your element as a hobby to make a job that you aren't passionate about worth it.
DeleteI also wonder how many of these authors - who are criticizing Jobs and his comment on finding a job you love - are actually in their elements as writers. Isn't that a little ironic? Sure, I've found my element, but YOU should just be happy to have a job at all . . . even if you never feel complete or truly alive.
I have to disagree with the article on Forbes. Steve Jobs was just giving the normal "pursue your dream speech" at graduation. Every graduation in the country has this speech in it. They tell all the grads to pursue their dreams and never stop trying to get a job in the field you love. Is Jobs supposed to tell the grads to not pursue their dreams and just settle on the first job they get? NO. The Forbes article says that "it might be a recipe for disaster." But I think that you should pursue your dreams. Like Steve Jobs said, "Don't settle."
ReplyDeleteJosh,
DeleteIt would be hilarious to see a graduation speech that amounts to this: the economy sucks, you don't have a snowball's chance, so get out there are flip some burgers for the next 15 years.
I wonder if that speaker would get out of the graduation hall alive?
I agree with Toby's comment regarding the fact that we should not be judged by a test score. Instead we should be evaluated on the creative projects we do and how they spread our ideas.
ReplyDeleteI disagree with the Forbes article. I think what Steve Jobs was trying to push was that people shouldn't just settle for a job that you live depressed your entire life. It is good to keep working to better yourself and your life. Jobs says "the only way to do great work is to love what you do." In my understand, Jobs wasn't trying to say everyone was to find a high paying high status career, but instead he is trying to say, find something you like to do no matter what it is. Their are plenty of people with "low" end jobs that absolutely love going to work everyday. I remember an episode of dirty jobs where a guys was a brain surgeon, but he hated going to work everyday. He quit his job to go do a "dirty job" and ended up loving every minute he spent at work. In my mind, I wouldn't want someone who hated their job as a brian surgeon to operate on me.
ReplyDeleteBrett,
DeleteI agree with the idea of not settling. It would be interesting to survey how many of our parents decided to 'settle' for their jobs. Then see how happy or how accomplished they feel now at that job. Hmmmh. Thanks for the idea.
Completely agree with Brett here! Jobs isn't telling everyone to go get their PHd. But rather to go find whatever it is that will make you happy! People always say, "Monesy isn't happiness." Like Brett's example, you quit the high paying career of a brain surgeon to be a low end dirty worker and your more happy! That just shows that you need to do what you love in order to be happy!
DeleteI also agree with Josh. As a graduation speaker your obligation is to give a rah rah speech to inspire the kids to do their best. You can't dis him for talking about what he is supposed to talk about.
ReplyDeleteI also disagree with the second article here. This is virtually the same thing as the first one and even has the exact same quote as the first article. Are there really that few quotes on not following your dream that you have to use the same one?
ReplyDeleteAnyway, in this article the author again thinks that everyone following their dream, "isn't actually very practical." And it also says that, "not everyone has the potential to be Steve Jobs." Well they don't have to BE Steve Jobs and found the new Apple. You just have to find something that you love to do. Maybe you won't make a lot of money doing it, and maybe you have to work some real crappy hours, but you still can love what you do. Take Reynolds for example, he doesn't make millions, but he still loves what he does for a living and thats all that really matters for him.
Josh makes a good point. Steve Jobs was giving a graduation speech and was just appealing to his audience, like every speaker tries to do. He is being singled out for being the successful Steve Jobs we all know. They could take anyone's graduation speech and say the same things. I would like to hear what Megan McArdle would've said at her graduation.
ReplyDeleteIn the article, "Steve Jobs' Bad Career Advice" I completely disagree with Fredrick Allen. He states, "Well, that’s absolutely right-on advice—as long as you’re Steve Jobs. For many, if not most, people, it might be a recipe for disaster." This isn't right whatsoever. I believe in order to be passionate about your job you must truly love what you do day in and day out. You've gotta be smiling day after day every time you walk through that workplace door. There should never be a time when you don't want to go to work. I feel that, this would be a true passionate feeling about work.
ReplyDeleteWhen Jobs states, "The only way to do great work is to love what you do. If you haven’t found it yet, keep looking. Don’t settle." He is completely right! Don't let yourself settle to be the average. Go above and beyond and become who your truly passionate about becoming. Steve Jobs never settled for working out of his garage did he? Well, look where it got him, I'd say it is rather good advice to be taken.
I agree with Brett's first comment. It doesn't matter what job you have, as long as you love going to work everyday. The brain surgeon quit his job for a "dirty" job. I think that just emphasizes the point that you shouldn't settle and should always be looking for your passion.
ReplyDeleteRobin Hanson makes an excellent point, unfortunately. If everyone did follow their passion, there would be a terrible amount of other jobs that do require someone to fill that void, "which are unlikely to be anyone's dream job." However, many reasons lead me to believe doing, maybe not what you love, but what you can learn to appreciate or enjoy is way more dire than doing something you just fall into.
ReplyDeleteMany people take a job just because it pays more and a few months in, they find it to be worse than where they were before. Other individuals get so depressed by their unfulfilled career, they commit suicide. According to an MSNBC article on this subject, career related suicides hiked up to "28 percent to 251 cases in 2008," which was "the most recent data available."
Maybe finding your dream job isn't always realistic, but perhaps finding what works for you and won't kill you is a less challenging feat.
What caught my eye in Megan McArdle's speech was this sentence: "And if they are to have any chance, they do indeed need to follow their bliss, and take risks rather than settling down to a degree in accounting."
So, how many of us, let's say in a week, take risks? Often, sometimes, practically never? We're too scared. We've lost our confidence and our sense of 'self'. We're too scared of people laughing at us if we say we want to be a sculptor because there's no way to earn money from it. Also, her word she used: "settling." I think that's what many do rather than follow their passion. However, her other word that caught my eye was "bliss." Ken Robinson talks of this when he speaks of our "element." Where we are happy, determined, most at peace, and our most powerful. If it's such a great experience for us, then why do fewer people follow their passion?
I agree with Megan McArdle in the first article from the Forbes when she says that she usually reassures young graduates that if they don't do what they thought they'd always do it's okay. She says that there is more time than they think to figure out what they ""want to do with the rest of their lives."' I think that thats a very positive thing to say because it shows that you don't have to give up and you have the rest of your life to keep trying to find something that you want to be doing, and be happy with it. If your not doing what you want, you still have time to change that.
ReplyDeleteI disagree with Will Wilkinson in the first article. Yes, there are careers that have a lower income, but if that's what ignites a person's passion, I believe that they'll learn to settle with the income because it's something that they love to do. If people were to focus mostly on "what they need to do to feed their family," there would be many more people who force themselves to do pick a high waged job, which could result in them hating it, and possibly just going through the motions each day, not really caring to do excellent work. As a patient at a doctor or dentist office, I would like to know that the person who was doing work on me, and who I'm paying a good amount of money to, would be passionate enough about what their doing and to know their doing everything they can. I think Steve Jobs states it well by saying, "Your work is going to fill a large part of your life, and the only way to be truly satisfied is to do what you believe is great work." So don't settle or force a job on yourself because of the wages. The most important thing is to do what you love to do, and with that will come passion to always strive to do the best work you can.
ReplyDeleteWow Josh. I totally agree with you and I like your attitude about this. We truly don't have to be Steve Jobs to enjoy our life. Your completely right about us just finding something enjoyable. I also totally love your example about Reynolds.
ReplyDeleteI also agree with Kirstyn's comment on Megan McArdle. It's never too late to find your passion. So even if you don't find your passion right out of college, you still have time to find it!
ReplyDeleteThe second article seems to be even more biased than the first. The author say, "they do indeed need to follow their bliss and take risks rather than settling down to a degree in accounting." First of all, I would like to point out that my dream job is in accounting. Just because the author doesn't find accounting to be a desirable career does it mean it is that way for everyone.
ReplyDeleteI agree not everyone is cut out be Steve Jobs, but that is not what his speech was about. If it were about that, he probably would've written it more like a how-to.
Megan McArdle, a senior editor for The Atlantic, quotes, "Now try to imagine a world where everyone actually tried to follow this advice. And notice that we have an awful lot of things that need doing which are unlikely to be anyone's dream job. So a few folks would be really happy, but most everyone else wouldn't stay long on any job, and most stuff would get done pretty badly. Not a pretty scenario." Megan makes a good point. However, when you think of it, everybody knows that not everyone will take this advice! If it was that easy, the world would have been changed long ago. Jobs knows that not everyone will take his advice, so he offers it to those who care to take it. Now that's a pretty scenario.
ReplyDeleteMegan also states, "Now notice: doing what you love, and never settling until you find it, is a costly signal of your career prospects. Since following this advice tends to go better for really capable people, they pay a smaller price for following it. So endorsing this strategy in a way that makes you more likely to follow it is a way to signal your status." She also makes a good point here as well. Again however, though it could be a cost of your future you need to look at in other ways as well. Everything that you do could affect your future dramatically, that doesn't mean you wont do it. Taking that chance and not settling could also make you the striving person that you want to be! You never really know unless you take the chances that are worth taking.
Cool example about our dentists and doctor's who work on us Lindsey. You made me really think about the people here in town. I mean, what if they really don't care enough about their job and just prescribe us crap to make us go away? Kind of scary. So, I think your right about it being more important to like your job, thus being better at it and maybe making a difference for someone.
ReplyDeleteI agree with josh, again. We don't have to be Steve Jobs. His speech isn't about being Steve Jobs. If we all were Steve Jobs we would have a great shortage in work force in other areas.
ReplyDeleteIn the second article from the Atlantic I disagree with Megan McArdle. She claims that "Steve Jobs', um, job, is to tell graduates how they could be Steve Jobs." I don't think thats the case at all, I don't think he's saying to be like him, he's just inspiring people to do what they love and chase their dreams. Then she continues to say how not everyone has potential to be like Jobs, which is obvious, but then she says there are few jobs that are actually fun, which I don't think is true. Not everyone has to have a greatly admired jobs or be famous like Steve Jobs to find happiness in what they do, and jobs she thinks might not be that great probably are to someone else.
ReplyDeleteIn the last paragraph of the Forbes article it says, "changing your attitude towards your job can be a lot more helpful than changing your job itself." I agree with this statement. Not everyone is going to go to a job that they love everyday, simply because not everyone is that lucky. Your attitude affects everything. If you have a good attitude you're going to have a better day and enjoy your job more. I believe that even if you don't like your job your attitude can change that and you can grow to like your job or at least think it's an okay thing to be doing. Your job does not have to be your passion. It would be great if it was but in reality it might not be. Having an hobby outside of your job that you are passionate is just as good. It doesn't have to be in your job. My dad does not have his dream job, but his dream job, especially since he only has a high school education, would not support the way that we live right now. His job allows him to do the things that he does love and provide well for his family. No he is not excited to get up and go to work, but he enjoys who he works with and gets the time off that he wants to do the things that he does love. So, I agree with the Forbes article, sometimes settling is just as rewarding.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Morgan, having a positive attitude towards whatever you're doing can really change the way you feel about what you do. If you do end up doing something that you hadn't planned on, having a good attitude about it could make it just fine. Like Morgan said, there are plenty of other things like hobbies that you can be passionate about to make you happy.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Lindsey, I hope our doctors are passionate about what they're doing and actually WANT to help us instead of just being there for the money or some other ulterior motives. People being passionate about what they do is important for reasons like that. We don't want teachers who don't want to be there teaching our kids, or doctors who don't care "helping" us get better.
ReplyDeleteWhen Megan Mcardle says "they have more time than they think to figure out what they want to do with the rest of their lives" and "their lives will not be over at 24" I agree. Those statements actually make me feel better about college because I really don't know what I want to do with my life. We really have our whole lives to decide. Yes we have to decide on a degree with in the next two years, but who says we can't change our minds? We are young and if we don't get our dream job right out of college when we are 22 years old, who cares! I agree with her about this. We are still young.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Kirstyn about Megan McArdle. Steve Jobs is just trying to help people go after their goals and be as happy as he is. It doesn't have to be the jobs that get you rich or the jobs that get you famous, it can be a job that makes you happy.
ReplyDeleteI also disagree with the second article. It's not telling the students how to "be" Steve Jobs, but instead being like him and find a passion you love instead of settling for something you don't. I think their trying to persuade people to find something they love to do. From this, they can be inspired by what Steve Jobs did and also to by the great things that he's accomplished. It shows that ordinary people can do great things if they set their mind to it. This starts by finding that love and passion that strives a person to want to achieve great things.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Kirstyn and how she says that people don't have to give up because they have the rest of your life to keep trying to find what they'll love doing. It's reassuring to know that it we do have more time to figure out our passion, because not all people will know after graduation.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Shanice's comment about Robert Hanson. He does have a great point about if everyone did do what they wanted there would be a lot of jobs left out. You can still be happy without your dream job as long as you let yourself be happy.
ReplyDeleteI also agree with Josh and how those are the typical things to say at a graduation to try to inspire your class to not settle for anything less than what they love to do. Being close to graduating, I think this would be a very effective graduation speech because it gives us hope for success in the world. It sure wouldn't be inspiring to talk about negative things like just settling for something they may not love because it's not good enough or they won't receive enough pay from it.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Steve Jobs when he states "Don't settle." You shouldn't settle on an activity that you hate doing. Although I disagree when he talks about not settling until you find it because that could take an entire lifetime and there are things that you can make worthwhile, by going in with a positive attitude.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Megan here because it really is all about having a positive attitude in everything you do! Having a positive attitude is key in finding your passion! Even when one does find their passion, they're still going to have to be positive about it!
DeleteI disagree with the second article when they say we should be Steve Jobs'. We shouldn't keep turning down opportunities just because they don't fit our needs. No job is going to fit every need and people need to be able to accept that. Every activity has it's ups and downs, but when you really find your passion you should have more up's then down's.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Morgan settling on something that you may not think is your passion, can actually turn out to be something that you love doing. For example I use to hate writing and now I love it because I made the best out of the opportunity.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Brett. The second article is more bias. They expect us to pursue careers that they think our passionate, not the ones we find passionate which is wrong of them. Everyone is different and everyone loves and is passionate about different things. Individuals need to learn this.
ReplyDelete